M
michael_edison
Member
Philipinese
- Jun 20, 2011
- #1
I wonder is there is a structure " promise sb to do sth" . Because I have done an exercise and it contains this one:
I was careful enough not to promise them ___ their daughter to France for the summer holiday.
A. to invite
B. invite
C. inviting
D. an invitation of
I chose D but the key shows the answer A . I really don't understand.
I am a learner. Hope your help!
Thanks in advance!
P
Perseas
Senior Member
Greece, Athens
Greek
- Jun 20, 2011
- #2
According to the following examples I would select also D.
http://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/british/promise_1
I think this is the case when "promise" gets 2 objectives (no infinitive).
Let's see what others have to say.
A
Archstudent
Senior Member
English - North London
- Jun 20, 2011
- #3
I think it is accurate to say that there is a far broader verb structure of:
{subject} {verb} {object} +[{verb} {object}]
{I} [was careful enough not to] {promise} {them} to {invite} {their daughter}
That sentence just conforms to this structure.
The reason why D is incorrect is that you would never say "an invitation of" in this way in any sentence, besides this example. If you wanted to use the word invitation in this case, you should say "I was careful enough not to promise them an invitation for/to their daughter."
Last edited:
Loob
Senior Member
English UK
- Jun 20, 2011
- #4
Hi michael
Actually, none of the options looks right to me. Simplifying:
I promised to invite their daughter
I promised them to invite their daughter
I promised them an invitation to France
I promised them an invitation of their daughter to France
A
Archstudent
Senior Member
English - North London
- Jun 20, 2011
- #5
Loob, read it again. A is correct.
Last edited:
GreenWhiteBlue
Banned
The City of New York
USA - English
- Jun 20, 2011
- #6
I agree that the sentences are odd. I would say "I was careful not to promise them that I would invite their daughter."
linguos
Senior Member
Bydgoszcz (Bromberg), Poland
Polish
- Jun 20, 2011
- #7
Strange, I was taught that "promise somebody to do something" is a perfectly acceptable structure.
I promised him to buy the milk on my way home.
A
Archstudent
Senior Member
English - North London
- Jun 20, 2011
- #8
I promise to do it later.
I promise that I will do it later.
Both valid. First sentence arguably simpler and more efficient.
A
Archstudent
Senior Member
English - North London
- Jun 20, 2011
- #9
linguos said:
Strange, I was taught that "promise somebody to do something" is a perfectly acceptable structure.
I promised him to buy the milk on my way home.
It is, in fact, to my way of thinking it is more efficient than saying promise somebody that I would do something.
Imagine the phrase: (shouting) Don't promise to do it if you can't do it! converted to Don't promise that you will something if you can't do it!
Maybe this is a Brit. vs American English thing.
entangledbank
Senior Member
London
English - South-East England
- Jun 20, 2011
- #10
I agree with Loob: you can promise someone something, or promise someone that you'll do something, or promise to do something, but not promise someone to do something. The OED does have a modern example of this:
I had promised Sarah to take 1000mg of VitC+Zinc every night if I went drinking. [from a 1998 book Rancid Aluminium]
But I would have to say that as 'I had promised Sarah that I would take . . .' None of the (admittedly small) 31 instances of 'promise them' in the British National Corpus are followed by an infinitive clause.
P
patricksecrets
Member
London, England
english
- Jun 20, 2011
- #11
linguos said:
Strange, I was taught that "promise somebody to do something" is a perfectly acceptable structure.
I promised him to buy the milk on my way home.
Yes, it makes perfect sense - and is definitely the best answer.
linguos
Senior Member
Bydgoszcz (Bromberg), Poland
Polish
- Jun 20, 2011
- #12
Damn it, 4 Brits, 2 of them being pro the promise someone to do something construction and the other two being contra. Whose advice should we poor little tiny foreigners follow then?
T
Thelb4
Senior Member
UK English
- Jun 20, 2011
- #13
To me "I promised him to buy the milk" sounds slightly wrong, but 'to' can be swapped with a similarly short word: "I promised him I'd buy the milk".
Or, in the case of the first post:
I was careful enough not to promise them I'd invite their daughter to France for the summer holiday.
You might even want to slip a that in before the I'd, if you wanted to be even more gramatically correct (eliding 'that' could make the sentence too confusing in the case of too many subjects/objects).
linguos
Senior Member
Bydgoszcz (Bromberg), Poland
Polish
- Jun 20, 2011
- #14
So what you're basically saying is that a lot of people are using this incorrectly? I believe that's a fairly common expression nowadays. Perhaps not in writings, but definitely in everyday conversations.
T
Thelb4
Senior Member
UK English
- Jun 20, 2011
- #15
The more I think about it, the more I realise that 'I promise (pronoun) to (verb)' sounds really wrong to my ears.
entangledbank
Senior Member
London
English - South-East England
- Jun 20, 2011
- #16
Can I make clear that we're not talking about the fully standard 'promise to do', but the much more debatable 'promise someone to do', with a human object before the infinitive clause. No-one is rejecting the use of 'to'.
linguos
Senior Member
Bydgoszcz (Bromberg), Poland
Polish
- Jun 20, 2011
- #17
Yes, but I'm sure I heard people saying things like "I promised him to buy the milk on my way home" many times.
What's even more funny now, I've just found an entry in one of the Larousse's English to French dictionariesand you can find there something like this:
promise [pledge] - promettre
to promise something to somebody, to promise somebody something - promettre quelque chose à quelqu'un
to promise somebody to do something - promettre à quelqu'un de faire quelque chose
So the French also believe this contruction to be correct!
P
patricksecrets
Member
London, England
english
- Jun 20, 2011
- #18
If you think about it carefully, 'I promised him to buy the milk on my way home' is
grammaticallythe best, even if 'that I would' is used more.
The original direct statement was 'I am going to buy milk', or 'I promise you that I am going to buy milk'. So we are now saying 'i promised him that I was going to buy milk', or more casually, 'i promised him to buy milk', where the
infinitive is retained.
It just so happens that this often more naturally comes out as 'I would'.
Last edited:
Loob
Senior Member
English UK
- Jun 20, 2011
- #19
linguos said:
Strange, I was taught that "promise somebody to do something" is a perfectly acceptable structure.
That's entirely possible, linguos. Promise + object + to-infinitive seems to have been unremarkable in older forms of English. Here's an example from the King James Bible:
2 Kings 8:19
Yet the LORD would not destroy Judah for David his servant's sake, as he promised him to give him alway a light, and to his children.
It's also entirely possible that it's still used in some varieties of English. A Google News search on "promised them to" throws up, for instance, this Sri Lankan example:
Women refugees want to come back | News
20 hours ago - ... India have sought permission to go to Sri Lanka on various purposes, ... The Collector promised them to take necessary action on their demands.” ...
print.dailymirror.lk/news/news/47462.html
That said, the (BrE) textbooks I have (Martin Hewings' Advanced Grammar in Use, and Michael Swan's Practical English Usage) advise against this construction.
(And I don't use it.)
Last edited:
K
kalamazoo
Senior Member
US, English
- Jun 20, 2011
- #20
The original sentence seemed fine to me, and I wouldn't have noticed anything wrong. It seems a little stranger when the relative roles of the people in the sentence are less obvious though as in the buying the milk example, which to me almost reads that I promised that he would buy the milk on his way home instead of I promised him that I would buy the milk. (I know it doesn't mean that,but it seems a little off somehow). And "promised them THAT ..." is definitely better.
A
Archstudent
Senior Member
English - North London
- Jun 21, 2011
- #21
I think it's just like any other verb... eg. I told him to do it, I sent him to hell (I promised him to come).
Actually, I believe you could equally flip round the "promise that I would" form to other verbs, eg. I ran that I might escape, I told him that he would do it, I sent him that he would go to hell (admittedly this sounds very archaic, but I as far as I know it is still a valid form!).. It's just a matter of common usage, what you are more comfortable with.
I can't see why you would allow I promised to do it, but not I promised him to do it. Although I do concede kalamazoo's point that sometimes the "promise that" form is clearer in terms of who is promising who.
Loob
Senior Member
English UK
- Jun 21, 2011
- #22
Archstudent said:
I think it's just like any other verb... eg. I told him to do it, I sent him to hell (I promised him to come).
"Any other verb" appears rather sweeping, Archstudent: I offered him to do it? I threatened him to do it?
But I fully accept that I promised him to do it seems fine to you.
A
Archstudent
Senior Member
English - North London
- Jun 21, 2011
- #23
You are right.. "Any other verb" in English would always be sweeping.
D
Danvit
Member
Italian - Italy
- May 26, 2022
- #24
Hello everyone!
Sorry for raising the issue again, but I wonder if, after over 10 years, there has been a development in accepting the “promise someone to do something“ structure.
Here are some sentences I’ve come across:
A) Bruce promised Billy to buy him a nice present.
B) Bruce promised to buy Billy a nice present.
C) Bruce promised Billy (that) he would buy him a nice present.
Could you please tell me if any of the above sentences are incorrect?
Thanks in advance!
Keith Bradford
Senior Member
Brittany, NW France
English (Midlands UK)
- May 26, 2022
- #25
I'd say that all three are possible. However, B) has a different meaning from the other two, in that it
couldmean (say) "Bruce promised Billy's mom that he'd buy Billy a nice present."
Loob
Senior Member
English UK
- May 27, 2022
- #26
Danvit said:
Sorry for raising the issue again, but I wonder if, after over 10 years, there has been a development in accepting the “promise someone to do something“ structure.
Here are some sentences I’ve come across:
A) Bruce promised Billy to buy him a nice present.
B) Bruce promised to buy Billy a nice present.
C) Bruce promised Billy (that) he would buy him a nice present.Could you please tell me if any of the above sentences are incorrect?
Hello Danvit
There's been no change in my view - A) still doesn't work for me.
D
Danvit
Member
Italian - Italy
- May 27, 2022
- #27
Thank you, Keith and Loob, for your replies.
So, I wonder what the acceptance of the “promise someone to do something” structure depends on: it’s still a mystery after 10 years!!!😅
sound shift
Senior Member
Derby (central England)
English - England
- May 27, 2022
- #28
Loob said:
There's been no change in my view - A) still doesn't work for me
.
... Or for me.
Loob
Senior Member
English UK
- May 27, 2022
- #29
Danvit said:
it’s still a mystery after 10 years!!!😅
I don't see any mystery. In my post 19, I said that it was clearly unremarkable in older forms of English. It's presumably lingered in some modern forms but not in others.
Wordy McWordface
Senior Member
SSBE (Standard Southern British English)
- May 27, 2022
- #30
My take:
C) Bruce promised Billy (that) he would buy him a nice present.
This is fine.
B) Bruce promised to buy Billy a nice present.
This is fine, too, but it's ambiguous. It could mean the same as C. But As KB says, it could also involve a third person; it could mean that Bruce promised
that he would buy Billy a nice present.
A) Bruce promised Billy to buy him a nice present.
I find this unacceptable. It would be marked as incorrect in an English test.
Last edited:
D
Danvit
Member
Italian - Italy
- May 27, 2022
- #31
Thank you all for your kind replies.
You must log in or register to reply here.